Need advice on replacing brake lines

[phatty5bmw]

Hey there guys. I just bought a 1974 Winnie D21. Sorry my intro is short but I don't have much time at home here and Got to leave for work mon-friday.

My motorhome is stuck at the place I bought it with no brakes. The Front left line blew and I got to redo all the brake lines before I can take it home.
I have to replace the front rubber lines and all the metal ones. What vehicle should I use to order the rubber lines from. I looked here a little and not sure
what ones I got to get. I don't recall seeing a "m" number on it and cant look because its 175 miles away

So, does anyone have a clue as to what I have to order? It is a 1974 Winnie brave and dodge chassis with a D21 on the tag.
The metal line is stuck on the rubber one so I am just going to replace it all.
I have to order it during the week so I can make a weekend out of fixing the lines so I can get the thing home! Thanks for the help guys I
really appreciate it!

Thanks in advance!

-Pat

[Clyde9]

Hi Pat,

Welcome to the club. We have some nice tech resources. http://www.classicwinnebagos.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=category&sectionid=11&id=27&Itemid=65 It is a great place to start. Also, NAPA has been my friend more times than I can remember concerning repairs of my Winne (69-D22).

Jack

[phatty5bmw]

i downloaded the stuff but still not sure what model to use for ordering lines!

[DaveVA78Chieftain]

The problem is that different sizes were used for different chassis'.  Even though you have a 74 Winnie, you most likely have a 73 chassis.  You could have a RM300 or a RM350 Dodge chassis which means different components.  Do you have the title in hand?  Some states used the Dodge VIN number for registration.  If you do, look at the VIN number on the title and see if it starts with something like R30, R40, M30, or M40.  If it does go to http://www.classicwinnebagos.com/forum/tech_resources/VIN_decoders/DodgeVINdecoder.html to decode your chassis.  Sixth digit is the year model of the chassis.  Your going to need the Dodge VIN number for almost anything related to the chassis.

[phatty5bmw]

Yes I have the title with me. It was produced in 73. The vin is R39CA3S205513. So when I call the auto parts store, I tell them I have what kind of vehicle? Dodge dealer cant give me info, Dodge corporation cant either, neither can winnebago or any other authorized winnie dealer. Dodge told me I have to call the Dodge museum for more info on my chassis.........

R3 R300 (RM300) 1974
9 Forward Control&Motor Home Chassis, Incomplete chassis, CB300 Kary Van, Sport Utility 
C 10,001 lbs to 14,000 lbs 
A 440-3

Now this is the problem. Its a 74 title and the 6th digit is model year, and 74 is not listed, it starts at 4 for model year and mine is 3.

Here is the 73 listings.

R3 R300 (RM300)
9 Forward Control&Motor Home Chassis, Incomplete chassis, CB300 Kary Van, Sport Utility 
C 10,001 lbs to 14,000 lbs
A 440-3
3 1973 J Series 
S Warren Truck #1 (Incl. Compacts) 
I would assume the last numbers is this Beginning with 000001 1973  All plants     but mine starts with a 2 and the rest is 205513.

I just not sure what to ask for at the auto parts store as this thing has to be completely driveable by this weekend!!! I have to have it drive well enough to get it home so I can finnish repairs on it before we go.  I am going for a camping trip may 1st 2nd and 3rd so I don't have much time to do this! Thanks so much for the help, I really appreciate it!!!

[The_Handier_Man1]

I wish I could help you with the brake lines for your rig, but I have no experience with those.  If you have a NAPA, or even Auto Zone, try to find someone who knows where the books are.  Not all the info is on the computer.  Even some Dodge parts guys know these rigs, but plenty have no idea what parts are on the shelfs.  Best of luck,  Les

[89Elanden]

Can you just replace the rubber part of the line that has ruptured now, until you can get it home and then investigate the hard line problem?

[phatty5bmw]

well thats my problem. The metal line is stuck in the rubber one. I cant get it off for the life of me. So they need replaced anyways, as they don't look like there in great shape and don't want to chance anything like that with the wife and kids inside. I will try to heat it up really good and get it off but it is rusted to beat the band. I just don't understand why it is so difficult to look up parts for the chassis!!! I don't know what chassis to use. Everyone tells me they have no clue to try and use someone else, they may have information......

Thanks!
-Pat

[89Elanden]

I'm no expert on brake lines, but I doubt the hard lines need replacing, how about cutting off the connections, cut the hard line, use a flaring tool, to re-flare the end of the hard line and again just replace the bad rubber lines.

[W0X0F]

You might try using a same year listing for a Dodge D350 1 Ton truck or van.  I have had some luck finding parts that way.

Good Luck!

HD

[DaveVA78Chieftain]

The sixth digit is chassis model year which in your case is 73.  Almost all of the classic Winnie's were built on the previous years Dodge chassis.  having a 74 Winnie on a 73 Dodge chassis is normal.  I have a 78 Chieftain on a 77 M400 chassis.

Ok, now that we know you have a 73 RM300 chassis, that means you have disc front brakes.
Going to the NAPA web site and selecting a 73 RM300 (1 ton) chassis, we get

Right Front hose NAPA P/N: UP 4900  (Dodge P/N 3733672) [7/16" - 20 / 7/16" - 24 Internal; 17.688" long]
Left Front hose NAPA P/N: UP 6222 (Dodge P/N 3733673) [7/16" - 20 / 7/16" - 24 Internal; 18.688" long]
Rear hose NAPA P/N: UP 36815 (Dodge P/N 3735349) [3/8" - 24 female fittings; 19" long]

Metal tubing is most likely 3/16 but thats one of those things that you simply have to match size/length as needed.  The Dodge Parts book does not list individual lines.

There is a very large amount of brake P/N info (Dodge, NAPA, Bendix, Raybestos, Wagner, etc.) on my website however brake lines were not something I researched.

If you have not done so already, be sure that you download the Dodge Chassis Service Manual and Dodge Chassis Parts book from the Tech Resource section of this web site.  You will need the information for many things.

Good luck,
Dave

[ontheroadagain]

here is a link to a company that does nice job they don't list the older dodge trucks but call them they bend lines for anything in steel or S.S. http://www.classictube.com/

[denisondc]

   For the brake hoses you would have to get correct replacement parts - and any place that works on light trucks (as opposed to cars) should be able to tell you where they get their brake hoses.  You have the chassis info, but finding an outlet that understands old light trucks may take some searching.  But I can almost assure you, those proper brake hoses are common enough, and there are enough old trucks still in use, that the hoses are sitting on someone's shelf.  Though I suspect not at Autozone or Advance Auto, or any other franchize that also sells car wax and carpets.
   Brake lines - the metal lines- are very standardized.  Most any auto parts place will carry a range of brake lines (aka Bundy tubing) in different sizes. You would buy more than one length, possibly 3 or 4 for a long run, and connect them.   Im thinking most of the lines would be either 1/4" or 5/16ths", and would have SAE threads, NOT metric threads.   The job of putting the new lines in involves snaking the old ones out, using a tubing bender to get the new lengths to fit in, then joining the sections with 'couplers'.   3/16" is the size of the brake lines on my Ford Escort - the M300 M400 chassis probably have bigger brake lines.
    You may find that you have new brake lines that are too long.  If so, you can cut off the existing flare, and using a double flaring tool, put a new flare on at the right length.   Be sure to have the flare nut on the line first of course.  The auto parts places also see new flare nuts - usually in their Dorman bins of pipe thread fittings, etc.   If you are able to do this work by the weekend - you are a whiz.  It takes me hours and hours to do it.
   And always use 6 point flare nut wrenches on brake lines!
    Good Luck!

[phatty5bmw]

Ok, I had some time to work it yesterday. I took the metal bracket off and took the rubber line off the caliper. Put it on the ground and heated the broken nasty metal line nut up with some map gas and squeezed as hard as I could and I got the metal line out of the rubber one. So that is done.

Now my next feat, getting the damn bleeders open. I did not have any sockets with me, and I don't have a good feeling they are going to crack loose on me. If they don't open for me, I have to replace the calipers.

Looking on napa's site, advance autos, autozone, nobody lists the RM300 chassis. Would calipers be the same as the D300 p/u because it is a 1 ton chassis also? I will keep doing research, but for some reason I just have no luck.

Thanks a bunch for the help!!

Pat

[DaveVA78Chieftain]

The part information your looking for is on my website.
http://dave78chieftain.zxq.net/DodgeChassis.html
Select brake info then Dodge Motorhome Brake Parts - Hydraulic System Reference Data (http://dave78chieftain.zxq.net/MasterCylinder.htm)
Scroll down to the M300/RM300 1973-78 (Front 12.82" Disc; 12" x 3" Rear Drum) section.
[Opp's, I see I listed caliper as 74-75.  That should be 73-75.]
NAPA does list the 73 RM300 however in this case, I had to use the Bendix site to get P/N information then X-ref that over to NAPA P/N information.  Bendix has the most complete brake listing information for the Dodge MH chassis.  There are links to the different web sites on my data pages.  RM300 can be also be listed as M300 or R300.

Dave

[phatty5bmw]

Awesome! Thanks for the very helpful information! For the record, Napa's caliper is 26.49 with a 16.50 core and Advance auto is 17.99 and 5.00 for core.

For the books, The calipers also Cross reference over to 1973 or 74 haven't checked 75 but as for the cross reference, the d300 and the part number for your site and napa is the same caliper!

So, Napa's caliper is SDC 2423014 for left and SDC 2423015 for the right.
Advance auto, or A-1 Cardone mfg is a 18-4074 for the left and a 18-4073 for the right.

So calipers will be ariving at the store in the morning, so all I have to do now....... is jack up the fronts and see if I can get the wheel lugs off.......................... ****pray****  HOPEFULLY things will get better!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks a MILLION!!!!
-Pat

[Cakeman2253]

You also might want to spray with PB Blaster for a few days prior. Helped me with stubborn bleeders

[phatty5bmw]

K I got it running! I fixed 3 out of 4 brake lines! The fuel is darned nastY!!! Pardon my french but, every 35-40 miles I had to replace the fuel filter because of nasty powder rust!!! I got the brakes working obvously!! I got a new caliper but everything is good but haven't replaced yet. The fuel tank is obvously rusty but it will take a couple of tank fulls to clear it out hopeully. I will replace the caliper soon since i busted a bleeder valve on the passenger front. engine ran great besides that. I think it is a go for the weekend after next! I got some minor shoot to do but should be done for the trip! Thanks so much for the recources and the info! i really appreciate it!!!!

-Pat

[Oz]

Good to hear you got it fixed and are looking forward to enjoying the camping season!

If there's a lot of rust in the tanks, you'll want to get it out, check them to make sure you don't have thin spots.  The last thing you need is to develop a fuel leak through a tank.  And, if there's that much rust in the fuel, you may go through a whole lot of "stop to change the fuel filter" episodes, before it get strained out.  Consider doing a Message Search on the topic of cleaning fuel tanks/POR 15.

[phatty5bmw]

Sorry I haven't posted back up since the big weekend!

On the way there, everything was going ok.... I had to replace 3 filters on the way there. I got 20 miles away from the destination, and I had a belt squeeling really really bad. Made it to a safe place to stop, found out my alternator belt slipped and broke!

There was 2 pulleys on the alternator. The previous owner for some reason put it on the one that was not in-line with the other pulleys so thats why that one shot.

I ran the generator to plug in a battery charger to the ignition system to get me there without draining my batterys.....

While camping, I put on new belts that were a 1/2 inch shorter so I could have more room to tighten when they stretch out a little bit.

The way there was a complete pain in the bum, it really was. But I made it and had a wonderful weekend! Camping in the old winnie was Awesome!!!

The way home I only ran 30 minutes behind because of the damn fuel filters.

Now were going camping memorial day weekend only 15 miles away (or about 1 fuel filter)

I just bought a universal electric fuel pump, and going to buy a spin on fuel filter adapter so I can just put a huge spin on fuel filter because I don't have the time to take the tank off right now.

Thanks for all the help!!!

Pat