Dodge 440 to 5.9 Cummins Diesel conversion

[Wantawinnie]

The transmission spacer arrived from PATC yesterday. Ordered the Gear Vendor adaptor on Friday so that might show up this week. Also, taking the radiator in to have it cleaned out and pressure tested.

Planning to get the engine and tranny back together tommorow and possibly installed if luck is on my side.

[ClydesdaleKevin]

Awesome!  I can't wait to hear how it all works out, power wise and fuel economy wise.


Kev

[LJ-TJ]

INCREDIBLE! Really enjoying and look forward to your posts and pictures. I think your going to help a lot of chaps down the road with their decisions on weather or not to make the swap themselves. Like you I'm sure can't wait to see how it turns out. Getting excited yet? Your doing a great job. Thanks.

[Wantawinnie]

Thanks guys!

I am getting quite excited to get the engine and trans dropped in. Really hope this takes some of the mystery out of doing the swap for others.

[Wantawinnie]

Another progress update.

This is the transmission spacer from PATC that allows the use of a heavier flexplate. It also comes with two longer dowel pins to center it. Pic 1

Here it is installed along with the new flexplate. The flexplate bolts were torqued to 100 ft/lbs. With it installed between the engine adapter and transmission the torque converter now spins freely with just enough play. Pic 2

Purchased new Cummins replacement engine mounts for the 89-93 Dodge Ram with Cummins. These are Anchor brand Part #2710.

Here are the mounts installed. The frame side post needs to be higher than the engine mount side in this application. Pic 3

Here we go ready to try and get it in the Winnie. Pic 4

[LJ-TJ]

HOLY COW  Look'n good 

[Wantawinnie]

Not done yet LJ-TJ. 

It wasn't quick, it wasn't the easiest thing I've ever done but, the Chieftain now has a Cummins in between the frame rails!

Frame mounts now bolted in place. Pic 1

Clearance to the rear. Pic 2

The height came out pretty good as well. Pic 3

Engine cover went back on without a problem. I still need to get the intake and intercooler tubing ran though. Pic 4

Here are a few things learned while installing it.

1)The vacuum pump canister on the early non intercooler engine will hit the radiator support strut on the driver side so that has to be removed and reconfigured at some point.

2) While the transmission crossmember is in the nearly the correct location, the height of the 4wd A518 is taller and requires the mount to be removed in order to get the engine and transmission in the proper location. It will have to be permanently lowered by a couple inches in order to get the transmission isolator installed. I do not know if this applies to the A518 2wd versions of this transmission or not.

3)The alternator on the Cummins must be removed in order to clear the front grill opening of the engine compartment.

4) The Cummins is a very heavy engine. Even with the forklift I had to use multiple jacks and ratchet straps in order to properly align everything until it was finally bolted in place.

5) It appears that the radiator will clear the front balancer on the Cummins by about 3/4". I will see if any more clearance can be gained by moving the radiator forward slightly. I would like to see about 1.5" of clearance when done.

6) I removed the intake, exhaust manifold, and turbo before installing the engine. I am pretty sure the manifold would have cleared but I doubt the turbo would have made it. Those will be fitted and installed later on.

I think the bull work is over for the most part. Projects that still need to be addressed are the wiring, fuel system, intake, exhaust, intercooling, cooling system, transmission mount modification, Gear Vendors install, and driveshaft modifications. I am sure more will come up as well.

[LJ-TJ]

>GRIN< Haaaahaaa  :)rotflmao Keep up the good work. Your doing a great job. I'm not sure what's going to be worse, making the swap or answering all the dam fool questions we're going to have for you when your done. Well done.

[ClydesdaleKevin]

You are making a stunning amount of progress in a very short time!  You're making me look like a slacker...lol!  Keep up the great work...I can't wait to hear and see the results!


Kev

[LJ-TJ]

Shoot you got half the guys on here look on Craig's list for parts already. >GRIN< D:oH!

[Wantawinnie]

After looking things over today I wasn't happy with the passenger side engine mount. It appeared to be putting excessive side load on the rubber isolator. You can see how the isolator was being pulled improperly in the previous post.

The fix was adding 3/4" spacers to the frame side of the mount to move it out further so the bracket would carry the weight instead of the isolator. I think it did the job.

[LJ-TJ]

Good move. Looks a lot better.

[Wantawinnie]

Today I got the transmission crossmember and mount installed. The crossmember remained in the same location but it was necessary to lower it approximately 2" down in order for the transmission to clear the tunnel. Dropping the mount required drilling new 1/2" holes in the frame mounting pad. With the transmission in place an angle drill is pretty much required for this.

The original style transmission mount was also able to be reused with slight modification. The A518 mounting holes are about 3 5/8" center to center and the 727 was about 4". I just opened up the holes and it bolted to the A518 without much problem.

The A518 and gear vendor setup usually requires a custom length driveshaft to be made because the one in the Chieftain is way too long now. In a stroke of luck the driveshaft out of the D24 parts chieftain is within an 1" of what I need and that can be made up by moving the midship bearing mount forward a little. 

Also, took the 440 radiator to a shop and had it cleaned and pressure tested last week. It got a clean bill of health so that wiill save some money.

[LJ-TJ]

Geeessss Don't for get the pictures. I can follow pictures. Duh i??

[Wantawinnie]

Time for another update:

Here is a picture of the relocated transmission crossmember and the original transmission mount from the 727 setup. There are originally 4 bolts on the crossmember. I ended up using only three on each side. The top two on each side and then an alternative one for the lower rear that is not used in the original configuration. The front hole ended up right on the lower frame rail so it was not able to be drilled out. Three still make for a very sturdy setup. The original brake line went back in as original. Pic 1

Rear tailshaft of the 4wd A518 transmission. Pic 2

This is the A518 to Gear Vendors adapter that I ordered. Pic 3

Adapter bolted up to the Gear Vendors unit and the assembly installed. Pic 4

The Gear Vendor uses a 1350 U-joint and the Winnebago has a 1410 U-joint on the driveshaft. I have ordered a combination U-joint to mate these together.

[Wantawinnie]

Next was solving the power steering line issue. The Cummins power steering pump uses a newer style 16mm x 1.5 O ring fitting. This poses a problem as the original Winnebago lines are flare fittings and the Cummins truck line has O rings on both ends that won't connect with the Winnebago steering gear. It is too short to work anyway.

I spent considerable time looking through parts to find something that would work. What I located was a line used on the late 80's and early 90's dodge full size van that has the correct power steering pump O ring fitting and nearly the same bends and length as the original Winnebago line. Here is a picture of the three lines. Pic 1

This is the O ring fitting needed for the power steering pump. Pic 2

Unfortunately, the Dodge van line has the wrong O ring end on it to work with the Winnebago steering gear. Pic 3

The quick fix is too cut off the incorrect fitting and double flare the Winnebago fitting on the the new line. My only reservation at this point is that the van line is 5/16" on the steering gear end for some reason instead of 3/8". My mechanic friend did the flare for me and thought it should be fine. If not I will find a reducer fitting from 3/8" to 5/16" and use a smaller fitting on the new line. I installed the line and it seems to work fine. I will update this once the rig is running if it doesn't work out this way. Pic 4

The return line is just standard 3/8" power steering line and about 24" is what is needed.

[Wantawinnie]

I mentioned earlier that a low mount turbo manifold is needed to clear the floor on Winnebago. I opted to use a newer turbo and a exhaust manifold off of a 2005 Dodge Ram diesel because I wanted a HE351 turbo and the manifolds are easy to find. If you don't want to make the following changes locate a low mount manifold from a Ford bus or big truck setup that had a 12 valve Cummins diesel. They are available new or sometimes can be found used.

The later 24 valve engines use a round exhaust port design which doesn't line up very well with the early 12 valve head ports. This is the original gasket to give you an idea what I am talking about. The gasket is actually misleading to some extent because the actual port in the head is about an 1/8" smaller than the gasket. Pic 1

I scribed around the gasket and then ported the manifold out and blended the ports back in about an 1" with a $15 harbor freight die grinder.

Here is the completed manifold after porting it out. Pic 2

While I was at it I drilled and tapped a 1/8" NPT hole to add a EGT guage down the road. Make sure to drill it in the rear of the divided port. Don't go in the center of the manifold because it has a divider in the middle. The rear side is supposed to run hotter so that is where the gauge should be located. Pic 3

I will just add this quick. The HE351 turbo has an electronic wastegate actuator from the factory that is computer controlled. Some guys recommend welding the wastegate shut on these when going on the early 12 valve engines or use some other method to keep it closed. I decided to use an adjustable spring setup like this so I can fine tune the turbo boost once I get it running. Once it is adjusted right the spring will allow the wastegate to open if boost gets higher than I want without having to let off the throttle. Pic 4

[LJ-TJ]

Well done. Keep up the good work. You've got us on the edge of our chairs waiting.

[Wantawinnie]

Next up is getting the wear items addressed. I put a new water pump on and replaced the idler tensioner pulley so they are good to go. I didn't get a picture of the fan hub and removal of the clutch fan as that went on later.

The radiator went back in the original location without issue. The driver side frame bracket does not fit with the vacuum pump on the Cummins. I am going to rig up a simple brace to take care of this problem. Pic 1

This picture was hard to get but it gives an idea of the clearance behind the radiator. There is enough that there won't be a problem. Pic 2

One pleasant surprise, the oil dipstick tube ended up coming past the radiator so I don't have to modify that. 

The frame crossmember, upper brace, and radiator overflow tank are back in. The upper brace was reversed with the horns to the rear in order to clear the intercooler that will be going in. Pic 3

This is just a little preview of what the intercooler will look like installed.  I plan to drop it down a few inches but you can tell something is going on behind the grill.  Pic 4

[audioguyinMI]

Holy crap, man.  That's one impressive bit of engineering.  One more on the edge of his computer seat...

[LJ-TJ]

>GRIN< this is incredible. Amazing. You don't know how many years guys on this site have been talking about this project and never been able to do it. Fantastic. I can see a run on diesel engines when you get this project done. You'll have to run and go into hiding when the project is finished or we'll all drive you crazy with question.

[ClydesdaleKevin]

Is the diesel engine and transmission considerably heavier than the stock drivetrain, or is it close to the same weight?  Just thinking about possibly necessary suspension mods if its a lot heavier.

Kev

[Wantawinnie]

Kev,

The Cummins weighs somewhere around 1150 lbs with all the accessories and the 440 it replaced was around 750 lbs from what I can find. I can tell you that with the Dodge RM400 chassis the extra 400lbs or so didn't phase it one bit. Granted the Winnebago is carrying more total weight but the suspension under there is much heavier than any 3/4 or 1 ton Dodge truck with a factory installed Cummins.

 

[Oz]

I'd like to add the observation that, with the age of around 40 years for this chassis, most of our Winnebagos suffer from bad front leaf spring weakness.  The suspension may have been able to handle the additional weight back in the day but now, I'm not so sure.  When I added the air bag suspension to my D24, there was an incredible difference in every aspect of suspension performance and it was overly apparent that, 74k miles and almost 40 yrs of resting on those leaf springs had taken its toll.

So, when considering if the suspension would need beefing up, one must seriously consider it's current condition.  If it's like many, much weakened from it's original capability, the added weight of the diesel motor may have a significant, detrimental affect.

[Wantawinnie]

Agreed, make sure everything checks out before doing a swap like this. My springs still appear to be in good shape for some reason. For side stability reasons I do plan on at least doing the rear air bags that are still available and possibly rig up a set of brackets and bags for the front as well.